Thursday Open Thread

Bush is giving a statement on the recent upheaval on Wall Street that will "emphasize that he and his administration are continuing to work on efforts to promote stability in the markets."

One of Palin's yahoo email accounts was hacked. There is concern that using personal accounts to discuss government business is insecure and also potentially non-transparent in that those emails aren't archived.

Microsoft is planning to strike back against the "I'm a PC" Apple ads. Open thread -- what's going on today?

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Privacy & hacking Palin's e-mail accounts.

Who ever did it should be prosecuted. It was wrong. It is informative, however, to see how the right has chosen this to play the victim. Glenn Greenwald points out:

"it's really a wondrous, and repugnant, sight to behold the Bush-following lynch mobs on the Right melodramatically defend the Virtues of Privacy and the Rule of Law. These, of course, are the same authoritarians who have cheered on every last expansion of the Lawless Surveillance State of the last eight years -- put their fists in the air with glee as the Federal Government seized the power to listen to innocent Americans' telephone calls; read our emails; obtain our banking, credit card, and library records; and create vast data bases of every call we make and receive and every prescription we fill and every instance of travel and other vast categories of information that remain largely unknown -- all without warrants or oversight of any kind and often in clear violation of the law.

The same political faction which today is prancing around in full-throated fits of melodramatic hysteria and Victim mode (their absolute favorite state of being) over the sanctity of Sarah Palin's privacy are the same ones who scoffed with indifference as it was revealed during the Bush era that the FBI systematically abused its Patriot Act powers to gather and store private information on thousands of innocent Americans; that Homeland Security officials illegally infiltrated and monitored peaceful, law-abiding left-wing groups devoted to peace activism, civil liberties and other political agendas disliked by the state; and that the telephone calls of journalists and lawyers have been illegally and repeatedly monitored.

Shouldn't these same people be standing up today and insisting that if Sarah Palin has done nothing wrong, then she should have nothing to hide? If Sarah Palin isn't committing crimes or consorting with The Terrorists, then why would she care if we can monitor her emails? And if private companies such as Yahoo can access her emails -- as they can -- then she doesn't really have any "privacy" anyway, so what's the big deal if others read through her communications, too? Isn't that the authoritarian idiocy that has been spewed since The Day That 9/11 Changed Everything -- beginning with the Constitution -- to justify vesting secret and unchecked surveillance powers in our Great and Good Leaders?"

Here's what I find important:

1) Palin has shown she's a perfect acolyte of Darth Cheney. Alaska requires it's elected officials to use Government (secure) e-mail and Palin uses Yahoo for Government business. Why? Because then an archive isn't kept on her coorespondence.

2) While Mayor of Wasilla, Palin was told she was acting against Alaska law she said "I'm the mayor, I can do whatever I want until the courts tell me I can't. '"

3) When Palin was confronted with illegally trying to pressure the Commander of the Alaska State Troopers to fire Palin's ex-brother-in-law, she pulls a bush43 move and declares neither she nor any state employees would honor the subpoenas issued by the Legislative investigative committee .

Conservatives try to act like they own "the rule of law" but in reality they are contemptuous of it and those that actually try to enforce conservatives to live by the rules they place upon all others.

What is the word for a group of people who compell others to live under rules that they themselves choose not to adhere to? Tyrants. Totalitarians. Royalists. Take your pick. None of them describe why our Founding Fathers fought a war with King George III over 200 years ago. Especially not to install a monarchy run by these fanatical right wing lunatics.

…………

What you seem to gleen over is...

....what Bush is doing is survielling those that would do us harm, yes, the evil doers, if you're not doing evil, you're in the clear.

Worked pretty well since 9/11 to huh?

Sarah Palin on the other hand is a citizen, one of the good guys, and her privacy WAS invaded.

Simple..but here it is special just for you...nice and slow now....here we go...

The right - catches bad guys and uses evidence in court or intelligence to bust THE BAD GUYS!

The left - invades citizens privacy, posts their SS# and personal email information on the internet and CRY'S FOUL about the indignant response outpouring from the American people?

Amazing!

"A society that puts equality before freedom will have neither. A society that puts freedom before equality will get a high degree of both." ~ Milton Friedman


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Of course.

Because it's not like Bush has lied to us befo-

oh.

I came. I saw. I posted.
Veni, Vidi, Bitchy.

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Correct. Prove that he lied.

No don't, I don't feel like spending the whole week proving different.

But I know where you're coming from. Are you one of those people that used to say Bush invaded Iraq for the oil....boy that's worked out well hasn't it.

How bout 9/11 itself...was that Bush too Tlaloc?

We know the economy and housing crisis is all his fault to of course?

ANyway, we get it...it's all Bush!

"A society that puts equality before freedom will have neither. A society that puts freedom before equality will get a high degree of both." ~ Milton Friedman


………… parent

Prove it? Sure.

Yet, at a press conference October 4, Bush was asked: "Of all the people in the United States you had to choose from, is Harriet Miers the most qualified to serve on the Supreme Court?" He said: "Yes. Otherwise I wouldn't have put her on."

Source (You'll like it, it's from Human Events)

I came. I saw. I posted.
Veni, Vidi, Bitchy.

………… parent

Huh?

Are you one of those people that used to say Bush invaded Iraq for the oil....boy that's worked out well hasn't it.

Are you trying to convince anyone that the oil companies haven't been making record profits since Iraqi oil spigot got crimped? Why don't you try to explain to me real slow how Exxon, for example, has been losing money.

Sic semper tyrannis

………… parent

The Iraqi's are doing just fine, and it's only...

...getting better.

Really I don't want to go around about that AGAIN today...

"A society that puts equality before freedom will have neither. A society that puts freedom before equality will get a high degree of both." ~ Milton Friedman


………… parent

And

what's the price of tea in China?

Sic semper tyrannis

………… parent

What? The Iraqi's are doing just fine, and it's only...

...getting better for them.

Record profits were a result of recent speculation by and large, and we are talking about the price of oil and profits over the course of the war, your allegation doesn't hold up.

"A society that puts equality before freedom will have neither. A society that puts freedom before equality will get a high degree of both." ~ Milton Friedman


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Sure it does

There's plenty of evidence to suggest it - you just chose to ignore it. And by strange coincidence price of oil and oil companies shares have been on a steady climb since the war started.

Sic semper tyrannis

………… parent

Prices have risen gradually...

with little anomaly since before the war, throughout the start of the war, and up until last year when speculation in the markets claimed oil no one ever took delivery of, but made crude look short, so prices rose sharply. Besides world events affecting a temporary spike here and there, that's it.

The Iraqis are selling oil like crazy , gas is still high...

Anyway you postulation is flawed.

"A society that puts equality before freedom will have neither. A society that puts freedom before equality will get a high degree of both." ~ Milton Friedman


………… parent

Looks

Sic semper tyrannis

………… parent

They haven't been profiting from

the Iraqi oil fields.

China looks to be the first to cash in:

Iraq and China signed a $3 billion deal this week to develop a large Iraqi oil field, the first major commercial oil contract here with a foreign company since the 2003 U.S.-led invasion.

[...] Jihad said the technical service contracts, which were to be finalized June 30, have been delayed as negotiations continue with the Western concerns, including Shell, BP and Exxon Mobil.

Come, my friends. 'Tis not too late to seek a newer world -- Tennyson

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They've certainly profitted

from the disruption to the flow of Iraqi oil spiking the price.

I came. I saw. I posted.
Veni, Vidi, Bitchy.

………… parent

Has to be true to some extent, agree,

but looks like most of the increase in price has come recently , at the same time that Iraqi output is up , back to pre-war levels. Demand has certainly increased since 2003 so there's still a net decrease but compared to the total world market for oil it's small.

Arguably instability (or the perception thereof) had a much larger impact on oil prices than the actual disruption to supply, though.

Anyway, I like this nuanced twist on the "no war for oil" argument =) Maybe we can copyright the "no war for less oil" slogan?

Come, my friends. 'Tis not too late to seek a newer world -- Tennyson

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Slogan...or Myth... You just proved it is a non-truth..

"A society that puts equality before freedom will have neither. A society that puts freedom before equality will get a high degree of both." ~ Milton Friedman


………… parent

They have an 80 Billion dollar surplus...

...that didn't come from selling view lots... ;-)

Iraq is raking in more money from oil exports than it is spending, amassing a projected four-year budget surplus of up to $80 billion, U.S. auditors reported Tuesday.

"A society that puts equality before freedom will have neither. A society that puts freedom before equality will get a high degree of both." ~ Milton Friedman


………… parent

Two things

First, the 4th amendment in my copy of the Constitution reads:

"The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized."

It does not say:

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized unless you're an evildoer or are otherwise a bad person in which case none of this applies to you.

If you dislike the 4th amendment, you are free to try to amend it. While you're amending the Constitution, please watch The Simpsons .

Second, the group who broke into Sarah Palin's email account are not of any political stripe. Anonymous is interested in nothing but seeing their names in the paper. This wasn't politically motivated. It was more along the lines of a few nerds in their mothers' basements trying to get some cred.

I never broke the law; I am the law! -- George W. Bush Judge Dredd
I'm listening to...

………… parent

Nice

This is how you mock, people. In an article about Sarah Palin's (probably illicit) Yahoo account getting hacked, the CS monitor sticks this shiv in our beloved leader:

Translation? If the feds were to contact an individual named Gabriel Ramuglia they might be able to track down the, as President Bush and Aquaman would say, “evil-doers.”

Story

Not only does it point out the fundamental cartoonishness of Bush's rhetoric but it also compares him to a superhero who is widely and roundly mocked as impotent and dumb. Coming out of the blue makes it all the more effective.

I came. I saw. I posted.
Veni, Vidi, Bitchy.

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Little Miss can't be Wrong

In our society, people are rewarded for pretending to be certain about things they're clearly not certain about. -- Sam Harris,

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Hagel says Palin is not ready to lead

GOP senator cites lack of foreign-policy chops.

How obnoxious can they get when Obama has exactly the same "foreign-policy chops" as Palin? Shameless.

"To discuss evil in a manner implying neutrality, is to sanction it." AR

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Exactly the same?

It would be nice if there were any evidence whatsoever that Palin was even interested in foreign policy before she was picked to be VP.

We are the environment. There is no distinction. What we do to the earth we do to ourselves. —David Suzuki

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oh, so now that is the differentiation?

Because of course you know Obama so well, you know that his surmised deep interest in Foreign Policy automatically makes him an expert in the field.

As far as we all know, they were the same and his running for president and expressing opinions on FP since that time, changed nothing.

"To discuss evil in a manner implying neutrality, is to sanction it." AR

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Interest ≠ Expertise

That's true. But I would say that a non-interest in Foreign Policy does automatically make one a non-expert.

Now, I don't know that Palin has a lack of interest, but as far as I can tell, she made no public statements regarding foreign policy whatsoever, before being picked as VP (except the one where she heard about the Surge on the news).

Obama has publicly shown an interest in Foreign Policy for years. I'm not seeing he's an expert (nor am I saying that he is not), but he at least has the minimum prerequisite of possible expertise, which I don't believe is true for Palin.

And again, whether you think that is important or not is up to you. But I think it is simply ludicrous to suggest that "Obama has exactly the same 'foreign-policy chops' as Palin."

We are the environment. There is no distinction. What we do to the earth we do to ourselves. —David Suzuki

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dude

Obama was running for President. Of course he needed to make statements on FP whether he was interested or not! Palin was not running for VP - what would be the purpose for Gov of Alaska to make any FP public statements whatsoever???

You are comparing apples and oranges. And Obama's FP interest while running for Prez means nothing and does not equal *any* "foreign-policy chops".

Why are we using running for president as any kind of qualifying experience - next thing you'll say that he has executive experience because he's been very interested in it.

"To discuss evil in a manner implying neutrality, is to sanction it." AR

………… parent

Yep.

You are comparing apples and oranges.

I agree with that, which is exactly why it is ludicrous to compare Obama and Palin foreign policy credentials.

We are the environment. There is no distinction. What we do to the earth we do to ourselves. —David Suzuki

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even though Obam's foreign policy expertise is...

...in all honestly very little better than yours.

Palin would be in the same category.

They are expanding that gap as they are privy to intelligence etc. now, but 1 year ago you or I could of had a equitable convo re; FP with either of them.

She is running for VP, I would suggest she probably has a great interest in FP right about now.

"A society that puts equality before freedom will have neither. A society that puts freedom before equality will get a high degree of both." ~ Milton Friedman


………… parent

If anything he's gaffed every foreign policy event he's...

...address during the course of the election!

Surge-wrong!
Withdraw from Iraq by March 2008-wrong!
Blowing kisses to the Russians-wrong!

He is being held to a comparison to McCain, not Palin anyway...but it is funny he has a weaker resume' than anyone else in the race as a whole, including SP!

"A society that puts equality before freedom will have neither. A society that puts freedom before equality will get a high degree of both." ~ Milton Friedman


………… parent

C'mon, you can do better. Let's get it straight.

Invading Iraq wasn't justified & was wrong.
Invading Russia because of S. Ossetia or Georgia would be wrong.

Barack Obama has a SIGNIFICANTLY better resume than Palin.

If you thought for yourself, talking to you would be a pleasant thing. But you only bring the rehashed republican talking points that are usually pretty poor.

………… parent

Kindness...wake up....your sleep posting... LOL!

"A society that puts equality before freedom will have neither. A society that puts freedom before equality will get a high degree of both." ~ Milton Friedman


………… parent

The same......

?????

please, stop pushing tall tales.

Obama's grasp of foreign policy is and has been one of the keys to his popularity.

Palin's grasp of foreign policy is much more limited apparently by her vision and which countries she can see.

Besides why are you trashing a war hero like Chuck Hagel anyway.

He served his country honorably, and you are calling him obnoxious. That's shameless trashing of a troop who served. Why do you hate America? :-l

It is the economy, stupid.

………… parent

Obama's grasp? LOL!

Obama has no grasp of FP!

His recycling of a withdrawal in 16 months made him popular with anti-war crowd ...till he let it slip that he's just moving all the hummer's over to Afghanistan, there went his popularity on that issue, and hardly qualifies as having "a grasp"!

And if the is any exchange of semen in the WH during an BO administration, the DNA evidence will surely be found on one of Chuck Hagel's ties!

"A society that puts equality before freedom will have neither. A society that puts freedom before equality will get a high degree of both." ~ Milton Friedman


………… parent

You are a disgusting pig.

"And if the is any exchange of semen in the WH during an BO administration, the DNA evidence will surely be found on one of Chuck Hagel's ties!"

Christ, you are a little freeper.

………… parent

C'mon guys

This is Swords Crossed - 'Pink-your-Doublet' and 'Slit-your-Trunk' - don't trade insults...

Sic semper tyrannis

………… parent

That sounds awfully naughty, Woodsman.

'Pink-your-Doublet' and 'Slit-your-Trunk'

I came. I saw. I posted.
Veni, Vidi, Bitchy.

………… parent

Cyrano de Bergerac :)

The bold Cadets of Gascony,
Of Carbon of Castel-Jaloux!
Brawling and swaggering boastfully,
The bold Cadets of Gascony!
Spouting of Armory, Heraldry,
Their veins a-brimming with blood so blue,
The bold Cadets of Gascony,
Of Carbon of Castel-Jaloux:
Eagle-eye, and spindle-shanks,
Fierce mustache, and wolfish tooth!
Slash-the-rabble and scatter-their-ranks;
Eagle-eye and spindle-shanks,
With a flaming feather that gayly pranks,
Hiding the holes in their hats, forsooth!
Eagle-eye and spindle-shanks,
Fierce mustache, and wolfish tooth!
'Pink-your-Doublet' and 'Slit-your-Trunk'
Are their gentlest sobriquets;
With Fame and Glory their soul is drunk!
'Pink-your-Doublet' and 'Slit-your-Trunk,'
In brawl and skirmish they show their spunk,
Give rendezvous in broil and fray;
'Pink-your-Doublet' and 'Slit-your-Trunk'
Are their gentlest sobriquets!
What, ho! Cadets of Gascony!
All jealous lovers are sport for you!
O Woman! dear divinity!
What, ho! Cadets of Gascony!
Whom scowling husbands quake to see.
Blow, 'taratara,' and cry 'Cuckoo.'
What, ho! Cadets of Gascony!
Husbands and lovers are game for you!

Sic semper tyrannis

………… parent

The only words I was worried about were

Nah, I'm not gonna say.

I'm a contributor now. I have a reputation to maintain!

I never broke the law; I am the law! -- George W. Bush Judge Dredd
I'm listening to...

………… parent

Alaska may be interesting this time round

For those who don't know, Alaska has had a big split in its republican party. Palin is one of the new faction that has tried to sweep out the old hands. She succeeded in gaining the governorship, but her contemporaries haven't fared so well. Both Don Young (rep) and Ted Stevens (senator) have won their primary fights and will be on the ballot this November. They are most definitely old guard. Palin is unlikely to help them campaign, even if she had time during a presidential campaign, because of the aforementioned split. Additionally both Young and Stevens are targets of a big FBI investigation that is quite likely to take Stevens down and reasonably likely to take out Young. Stevens has in fact already been indicted.

That makes it quite possible that Alaska will have a dem Senator and Representative (the other senator is a republican, not up for election this year). Alaska hasn't had a democrat senator since 1980.

At the same time the old guard republicans in the Alaska state senate are gunning for Palin, and hence cooperating with democrats in the troopergate scandal.

All in all Alaska has suddenly become a very interesting political spectacle this year.

I came. I saw. I posted.
Veni, Vidi, Bitchy.

…………

A little wager...?

Both will be RED!

"A society that puts equality before freedom will have neither. A society that puts freedom before equality will get a high degree of both." ~ Milton Friedman


………… parent

Based on...

Here's the state of the polling for Stevens. Here's the same for Young.

I'm not saying it is a sure thing these seats will flip. I'm saying there's a decent chance. I think both a qualitative and quantitative analysis bears that out.

So do you have any data or perspective to support a counter-argument?

I came. I saw. I posted.
Veni, Vidi, Bitchy.

………… parent

No, just my political intuition...Thats why I said a wager...;-)

I think it it Palin Mania there right now, before she was picked as VP her approval rating was 85%.

The Republican dissenters are in a small minority.

I think Republicans will sweep the State.

"A society that puts equality before freedom will have neither. A society that puts freedom before equality will get a high degree of both." ~ Milton Friedman


………… parent

But you're ignoring

that both Stevens and Young just fought primaries against Palin allies. So in the first place they are not well positioned to benefit from "Palin mania" and in the second place obviously the dissenters (a term that really applies more to Palin's bunch since they split from the old guard reps) are not a tiny facton- they include the current senator and representative, as well as the head of the state senate, and they were successful in their primaries.

Palin does seem pretty popular, and I think it is very likely that McCain gets Ak's electoral votes. Young and Stevens are a very different matter. Even assuming no more FBI investigation news comes down Young is probably toast and Stevens has about a 50-50.

I came. I saw. I posted.
Veni, Vidi, Bitchy.

………… parent

Don't you know polls only count when they agree with him?

………… parent

(From back of the room-a high pitched-skeechy-liberal schrill)

..."Don't you know polls only count when they agree with him"!

I asked him if he would care to wager as I felt otherwise...DESPITE the poll.

Ok with you?

Or here maybe this helps...

(From back of the room-a high pitched-skeechy-liberal schrill)

...Ok with you?

"A society that puts equality before freedom will have neither. A society that puts freedom before equality will get a high degree of both." ~ Milton Friedman


………… parent

Shameful joy

I have to admit a certain sense of amusement that Redstate not only took money from their parent company (Eagle Publishing) but also held a big beg-for-cash even in order to get their RS 3.0 up and running and the things is a total POS that works about 1/10 as well as the free software SC is based off.

I just find that funny. Particularly when the software won't work worth a damn during the run up to a major election.

It's kind of like a microcosm of the republican party for the last decade- expensive, incompetent, self defeating.

I came. I saw. I posted.
Veni, Vidi, Bitchy.

…………

I agree (minus the joy)

Their software is a POS. I don't know what they paid for but it is horrid.

Also I believe we will be rolling out a new version of SC - hosted on a hopefully faster service sometime in the next 2-4 weeks, in time for the election. Which should hopefully be 20 times better than the RS software :)

RS made a mistake - for the kind of money they spent, I would've custom programmed this free software to give them something a LOT better than what they have.

"To discuss evil in a manner implying neutrality, is to sanction it." AR

………… parent

Almost makes you wonder

where the money went, huh? Just their beg-a-thon was trying to scare up 25 grand. I have no idea how much Eagle gave them. Did they get taken, or did a good part of the money for the upgrade end up in their pockets?

Don't know.

It's kind of sad but kind of funny, in the same way that the fact that the National Review (champion of free market ideology) has never broken even, much less made a profit, is funny. People who espouse a standard by which they themselves are losers crack me up :)

PS you can see the much mocked original bleg here if you are so inclined.

I came. I saw. I posted.
Veni, Vidi, Bitchy.

………… parent

Meh

Having one's bloviatons replicated hundreds of thousands of times on glossy color stock and having said bloviations shipped to an audience around the world is worth a lot to hardcore ideologues.  That's why you can't just look at the bottom-line finances of a labor-of-love enterprise like the National Review and say 'aha! These free-market demagogues can't even run a profitable business!' because perhaps they could make it a profitable business but are unwilling to abandon core principles that would be needed to be abandon in order to make a magazine that would appeal to a wider audience.

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I understand why they do it

but the fact that they do it is a repudiation of everything they claim to believe.

They profess an adherence to a "marketplace of ideas" where ideas of merit elevate naturally and yet they rely on welfare to get their own message out.

It tells you something.

I came. I saw. I posted.
Veni, Vidi, Bitchy.

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The National Review gets government aid?

NT.

………… parent

No

not government welfare but they rely upon the charity of others (while decrying that anyone else should get the same).

Yeah, I know the official line is that conservatives are fine with charity, except that that's not how businesses are supposed to operate. In fact charity is one of those dreaded "market distorting forces."

I came. I saw. I posted.
Veni, Vidi, Bitchy.

………… parent

Well...

There's no doubt why they don't like free software/open source offerings.

I never broke the law; I am the law! -- George W. Bush Judge Dredd
I'm listening to...

………… parent

That's funny

but not as funny as the guy writing code on an emac LMAO.

Sic semper tyrannis

………… parent

hehehe n/t

"To discuss evil in a manner implying neutrality, is to sanction it." AR

………… parent

LOL. -nt.

I came. I saw. I posted.
Veni, Vidi, Bitchy.

………… parent

Israel picks Tzipi Livni

"Israel's Foreign Minister, Tzipi Livni, has narrowly won the ruling Kadima party's primary for a new leader.

Livni, a former Mossad agent, is Israel's lead negotiator in peace talks with the Palestinians and has taken a concilliatory approach in negotiations. She has also stressed negotiation with Iran and it has been reported that she doesn't believe the "existential threat" nonsense bandied about by hardliners."

She isn't a push over. She was originally elected to the Knesset as a Likud party member.

Let's all hope she helps bring peace. It won't be easy but better than if Netenyahu was still throwing bombs at everyone.

…………

Sounds promising all around (nt)

Come, my friends. 'Tis not too late to seek a newer world -- Tennyson

………… parent

Cool!

It is the economy, stupid.

………… parent

Palin is now stealing Obama's idea's in stump speeches

" Sarah Palin likes to tell voters around the country about how she "put the government checkbook online" in Alaska. On Thursday, Palin suggested she would take that same proposal to Washington.

"We're going to do a few new things also," she said at a rally in Cedar Rapids. "For instance, as Alaska's governor, I put the government's checkbook online so that people can see where their money's going. We'll bring that kind of transparency, that responsibility, and accountability back. We're going to bring that back to D.C."

What a good idea. Why didn't someone think of that before?

Oh wait, someone did. His name is Barack Obama.

In 2006 and 2007, Obama teamed up with Republican Sen. Tom Coburn to pass the Federal Funding Accountability and Transparency Act, also known as "Google for Government." The act created a free, searchable web site -- USASpending.gov -- that discloses to the public all federal grants, contracts, loans and insurance payments.

In June of this year, Obama and Coburn introduced new Senate legislation to expand the information available online to include details on earmarks, competitive bidding, criminal activities, audit disputes and other government information.

According to Sarah Palin, one of Obama's ideas from 2006 qualifies as one of the "new things" she'll do in 2009."

Sarah is quick, I'll give her that. I hadn't realized she had such sticky fingers as well.

…………

Brendan

you might want to add the discussion about the constitution and interpretation starting roughly here to the open thread discussions.

Of course that may be immodest of me since it's principly me and John Mark mucking about. Still I thin it's an interesting discussion with useful contrasting debate points.

I came. I saw. I posted.
Veni, Vidi, Bitchy.

…………

Good idea!

"A society that puts equality before freedom will have neither. A society that puts freedom before equality will get a high degree of both." ~ Milton Friedman


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Second RW, good idea

but perhaps you'd prefer to add it yourself, so you can describe it however seems best.

(Otherwise I will do so tomorrow.)

Come, my friends. 'Tis not too late to seek a newer world -- Tennyson

………… parent

Bailout Blues

CNN .

…………

Moderately funny

Apparently the daring raid of Governor Palin's (probably illicit) email account was accomplished by guessing the answer to her "I forgot my password" question. In case you are wondering the answer was apparently her high school.

I totally think she should be in control of launch codes.

Totes.

I came. I saw. I posted.
Veni, Vidi, Bitchy.

…………

Action-reaction pairing

Russia defied the United States yesterday by announcing plans to sell military hardware to Iran and Venezuela.

The head of Russia’s state arms exporter said that he was negotiating to sell antiaircraft systems to Iran despite American objections. Russia has already delivered 29 Tor-M1 missile systems under a $700 million (£386 million) deal with Iran in 2005.

“Contacts between our countries are continuing and we do not see any reason to suspend them,” Anatoli Isaikin, the general director of Rosoboronexport, told the RIA-Novosti news agency at an arms fair in South Africa.

Reports have circulated for some time that the Kremlin is preparing to sell its S-300 surface-to-air missile system to Iran, offering greater protection against a possible US or Israeli attack on the Islamic republic’s nuclear facilities. The missiles have a range of more than 90 miles (150km).

story

edit- apparently wonkette has dubbed Palin Bible Spice. That's also kinda funny.

I came. I saw. I posted.
Veni, Vidi, Bitchy.

…………

Sabre rattling begets more sabre rattling

In our society, people are rewarded for pretending to be certain about things they're clearly not certain about. -- Sam Harris,

………… parent

I wonder why my link failed.

ah well. Thanks for the working one.

I came. I saw. I posted.
Veni, Vidi, Bitchy.

………… parent

Oracle?

Your link is missing the ".ece" at the end

In our society, people are rewarded for pretending to be certain about things they're clearly not certain about. -- Sam Harris,

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ABC: Obama Lying/Race-Baiting in Two Languages

This one just takes the cake!

The greater implication the ad makes, however, is that McCain is no friend to Latinos at all, beyond issues of funding the DREAM act or how NCLB money is distributed. By linking McCain to Limbaugh’s quotes, twisting Limbaugh’s quotes, and tying McCain to more extremist anti-immigration voices, the Obama campaign has crossed a line into misleading the viewers of its new TV ad. In Spanish, the word is erróneo.

 

 

"A society that puts equality before freedom will have neither. A society that puts freedom before equality will get a high degree of both." ~ Milton Friedman


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Not.

McCain was unable to stand up to the populist anti-immigrant rant brought on by his own party, of which Limbaugh was one of the biggest cheerleaders.

Remember how funny that song was Rush used to sing...... Barack the magic negro?

It is the economy, stupid.

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Really - Do you read the links - Or just spew forth...

As first reported by the Washington Post, Obama's ad features a narrator saying: "They want us to forget the insults we’ve put up with…the intolerance…they made us feel marginalized in this country we love so much."

The screen then shows these two quotes from Limbaugh:

“…stupid and unskilled Mexicans”
—Rush Limbaugh

"You shut your mouth or you get out!”
—Rush Limbaugh

There are some real factual problems with this ad, which is titled “Dos Caras,” or two faces.

I’m not going to defend how he said it, but to act as if this was just a moment of Limbaugh slurring Mexicans is not accurate.

The second quote is totally unfair. In 2006, Limbaugh was mocking Mexican law.

But even if one is uninclined to see Limbaugh's quotes as having been taken unfairly out of context, linking them to McCain makes as much sense as running a quote from Bill Maher and linking it to Obama.

The greater implication the ad makes, however, is that McCain is no friend to Latinos at all, beyond issues of funding the DREAM act or how NCLB money is distributed. By linking McCain to Limbaugh’s quotes, twisting Limbaugh’s quotes, and tying McCain to more extremist anti-immigration voices, the Obama campaign has crossed a line into misleading the viewers of its new TV ad. In Spanish, the word is erróneo.

"A society that puts equality before freedom will have neither. A society that puts freedom before equality will get a high degree of both." ~ Milton Friedman


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Just a sec

If McCain was a friend of Latino's he wouldn't have caved to the 'we hate mexicans' immigrant bashing rhetoric of his party. He obviously stood more with the Bush/Kennedy position of being more lenient wit